Possible Electric Bicycle ? [ trolling motor ]

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

This is WAAAY off topic for me because I must be honest and say I have little experience in this area but know enough to say I have never seen any electric motor I felt IMO delivered the power nor long range freedom of an internal combustion engine for practical bicycle use .... I'd sure like to hear opinions from people who have experimented with electric power and get input from anybody who might have tried the following :

I outfitted my boat with a new Minnkota 80 pound Auto Pilot trolling motor and the older 40 pound thrust motor has been sitting unused. Fooling with it yesterday has really convinced me that converting a 40 pound thrust trolling motor to a bike engine has worlds of possibilities for reasons I have always taken for granted in using them on my boat, but never considered the same features that make them work so well for pullling craft would surely be the same on land with such a light load as a bicycle.

None of the points following are anything new to serious trolling motor fishermen but others might not be familier with how strong a trolling motor actually is ....

1. A BASIC 40 pound thrust trolling motor costs about $250,used ones are on Ebay a lot too.

2. 40 pound thrust (AS AN EXAMPLE) can move my 20 foot bowrider from dead stop with enough thrust to make you lurch back a bit if your not prepared,just to give you an idea of the load pulling capability.Were talking about 2500 lbs of mass in this case.

3. Most interesting however, is run time from a 12 volt battery .... Any average 40 pound thrust troller will let you pull at full power (another plus,power is infinitely adjustable ) for AT MINIMUM in my 20 years of troller experience, about 4 hours and that's in the WORST possible scenerio ie,headwinds, fast water, lots of speed changing.

In normal scenerios, with the battery saver circuitry that all the big trolling motor companys tout, 8 full hours from a full sized marine battery is not unheard of. 6 is absolutely common I do it all the time.

4. Motors are already rigged to reverse (just for giggles)
5.Propeller removes in 4 seconds,welding on a standard chain sprocket is a no brainer
6.Fully waterproof of course
7.sleek bullet housing would accept a variety of mounting tecniques,and the shape readily suggests mounting directly behind the seat over the hub with the battery occupying the normal place we put our chinese motor.

8. Biggest problem is of course the size of a marine trolling motor battery or any large sized auto battery. Enen low on the frame we are talking a lot of weight. Anyway, has anyone ever messed around with a trolling motor for this purpose ?

[srdavo]

very interesting!!

Do you know what the max. rpm's are for your motor?

that will give us an idea of what to expect of it...on wheels.

gear ratio adjustments, to fine-tune it.

I think you are onto something.

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

No I don't, but it's going to be fast enough .... my 40 pound thruster on full power looks like a table fan and easily blows my hair around wildly. As to gear ratio adjustments, I'd not considered that because trolling motors are variometer equipped and speeds are infinite adjust on most, or 3 speed click settings on the cheaper ones. Torque is probably the LEAST concern, in fact most experienced trollers will tell you the biggest concern wth accidental grounding or entering too shallow water is the damage done to the prop because the motor just never jams up and stops, it normally causes huge gouges in underwatwer logs, breaks its deliberately break away prop too, but stopping the shaft under power is not going to be a concern .

[srdavo]

when I mentioned adjusting gear ratios, I meant in relationship to what speed & how much torque a bicycle will have, powered this way.

variable speed on the motor is a big plus.

wheels are turning here....

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

It was so easy as I stared at it yesterday it was scary ... removing the control head while sparing the wiring that runs up thru it will take only no brainer work with a dremel, and retaining the speed/reverse potientiometer inside the head shell is probably the only part that takes a little slow careful restyling.

[srdavo]

I've been to the MInn Kota website. I took a crash course in "thrust".
I emailed them about rpms & watts.
here's their reply:

Dave-

All Minn Kota trolling motors average to being about 1400 RPM’s as they are not designed for speed – just designed to push weight over the surface of the water so one can fish. The more thrust you buy – the heavier a boat it will handle on the water. “amp draw multiplied times voltage = wattage”

Barbara

Technical Services

Minn Kota - Cannon

[JemmaUK]

Originally Posted by WIZARDOFOZONE

[b]
8. Biggest problem is of course the size of a marine trolling motor battery or any large sized auto battery. Enen low on the frame we are talking a lot of weight. Anyway, has anyone ever messed around with a trolling motor for this purpose ?

This may sound a little weird - but why not make an inline battery tray that mounts in front of the crank aka the positioning of the 98cc engine in the old autocycles...

That would solve the balance problem because the weight would be as low as possible.

Just a thought...

Jemma xx

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

Srdavo, do you have an idea then of what this means to us speedwise ? What would 1400 rpms do ? I'm basing my belief that it would be adequate based on a bicycle shop here that sells a factory built motorized bike with just a friction roller on the tire that does about 14 mph on a motor about 3 inches in diameter and about 4 inches long ... seems just on a loosey goosey site comparison, a 40 pounder should get at least 20 mph no ?

Not to mention that my boat alone when underway on just that small motor shows at least 10 mph with all that weight plus water drag ... Actually, I guess knowing what the chinese engine is doing rpm wise would be a good gauge ... or even better,since I wasn't thinking about an electric motor matching the speed of a gas engine ... what is the average rpms of most factory made electric bikes is the best question.

[WIZARDOFOZONE]

Jemma, yes that's not weird at all ...in fact I don't think theres a much better or lower place to put it .... those super large marine batts are at least 45 pounds or more I'm guessing.

[JemmaUK]

1400rpm would have to be geared down somehow but so far as I know its not the revs of an electric motor that are important its the torque like a diesel... the rpm is low but at a given speed the torque is high so it will take a high load...

What you *could* do is put a slow-speed centrifugal or a lock out manual clutch between the engine output and the sproket (assuming you are using chains) an since the engine is already forward/reverse it should be possible to run a tensioned chain from the front to the deraillier (assuming you are using one via the output on the clutched engine..

This would need a lot of work on tensioning to get right but with the clutch disengaged it should allow normal pedalling & a multispeed transmission without the need for a jackshaft...

Jemma xx